If there are some opinions that teensy dogs should get half-doses of some vax, does anyone ever insist that a huge breed get a double dose?

Never. Never even heard it discussed as an issue. Great question.

I'd love to see the manufacturers do weight-specific trials. They would certainly answer some questions that no one knows definite answers to now.
About the rabies vaccine: glad that you stick with the full dose. Is it known to cause reactions? I know most are assumed to be from DHPPs and other vaccines, but is there any research that has shown the rabies caused VAAE?

From the 2007 compendium for Rabies Prevention and Control published in the JAVMA of that year:

"Currently, no epidemiologic association exists between a particular licensed vaccine product and adverse events, including vaccine failure."

Not that there haven't been adverse reactions, but that there's been no epidemiological association. This statement, however, was based on two references, both papers seeking to correlate the rabies vaccine with vaccine-associated sarcomas in cats.

Here's the abstract for the study I referenced.
http://avmajournals.avma.org/doi/abs/10.2460/javma.2005.227.1102?prevSearch=allfield%253A%2528vaccine%2Bdose%2B2005%2529&searchHistoryKey=

It's a shame that many, many vets try to save $ by using the combination vaccines. People are absolutely willing and would prefer to spend a little more on a single vaccine than to risk lifetime health issues in their pets.....

Also a shame that they subject every dog and cat to every vaccine when, in fact, they only need the vaccines for illnesses to which they may be subjected.

Any newer studies than 2005? Is it not true that the Rabies vaccine now approved to provide protection for 3 years is the exact same vaccine that was given annually for decades?

Is it also not true that it is believed that this same Rabies vaccine will protect a dog for 10 years or perhaps it's entire life?

This is an interesting read on Vaccinosis (parts 1, 2 and 3) if anyone is interested.

http://www.thedogplace.org/VACCINES/Vaccinosis-1_Bloomer&Thomason.asp

Just asking and providing food for thought. Love to learn all I can about vaccines. I do a lot of reading about this topic and attend every seminar by a vet that I can find.

I told a vet my dog could have only the parvo vaccine - not a combo vaccine. She said OK but while looking back at the bill after the dog had a reaction, I saw she had given a combo vaccine. She knew I wanted to give only rabies, parvo & distemper and that I wanted them separated by a month. But she did what she wanted to do instead of what I asked her to do. I had even asked specifically if she had just Parvo and she said yes. But I've only been able to find one vet who carries them here.

Heh!
My vet's receptionist called around asking for PureVax feline rabies for me. Took me a while to get around to it, so I called around again to locate vax. I specifically asked for PureVax 1 year feline rabies. Since my vet's son couldn't even pronounce adjuvants, I didn't add, the non-adjuvanted vaccine to my request. The receptionist at the clinic where I ended up taking the kitten even asked someone before she responded. She said yes. When I got home and looked at the paper it said Rabies Defensor. This is an adjuvanted vaccine.

Does no one listen? Are they stupid? Or just wiley? I feel less and less like going to any vet each time I encounter them. Should I have asked to see the vial first? Just how obnoxious do I have to be to get what I asked for? It's getting really really hard not to take an adversarial position right out of the box.

Now I have to go talk to my vet about pain control for spaying. Doubtless this will turn into another hassle no matter how much I soft pedal it.

Bah.

I keep getting e-mails that make no sense from this web site address: fvcomments@petmd.com

When I respond, I get a Mailer-Daemon saying the address doesn't exist.

The last message started with "Hi, Black Wolf,....." It indicated that my posting must have thought the photograph was the patient discussed and explained where it came from.

I never mentioned the photo in my comment......

Also - I always uncheck to be notified of replies.

???????

It was been 18 + yrs, took my 5 Chihuahua, to our Pet Doctor, for their shots etc. Mom and Dad did well, but our 3 Boys lost their hair, were the shots were given, never to return. Our Doc felt really bad.....Note; I was gonna raise Chihuahuas; to Heck with That and kept them all...only one left, my sweet boy will be 21, this year. Every-day with Him, is a Gife from God.

There is a misconception about the nature of vaccines that is relevant to the question asked in this post. Vaccines are not like drugs in having a continuous relationship between dose and effect. Instead, there is a threshold below which no immune response is triggered and above which a full response is triggered, called the Minimum Immunizing Dose. When vaccines are developed and tested, the amount of antigen in the vaccine must be at least the MID, and it is usually a little more to allow for spillage and mixing errors.

I explain it to clients this way: A drug is like a dimmer switch on a light. The farther you push the switch, the more light. A vaccine is light a regular light switch. If you don't push it far enough, nothing happens, and when you push it past the critical point, the light comes on all the way. So the idea that a half dose of vaccine makes sense for smaller animals may be intutively obvious, but it happens not to be true due to the underlying biology of the immune system.

Smaller dogs are more likely to have vaccine reactions, but this is not directly a function of the dose of vaccine. Even though such reactions are VERY rare and rarely serious, I routinely ask clients with small breed dogs to wait 1-2 weeks between different vaccines just to further decrease this risk. However, I never give less than the full dose of a vaccine because it is very likely not to achieve a protective immune response.

Your assumption is still that the MID is the same for all individuals regardless of weight, which has not been proven. It is like a regular light switch, but we just don't know what factors effect the MID needed and if weight might be one of them.

The 5-Chihuahua-Pet Kids story..........Mom and her 3 Boys were Fixed.....Dad, Pinkerton stayed a Stud a supported his Family.....sweet huh

The clinic I work for (a Banfield) has a company-wide policy of offering a pre-vx diphenhydramine injection to chihuahuas, pugs, min-pins, doxies, and bostons - an extra safety precaution given that those breeds are statistically more likely to have adverse reactions.

I think the important thing to keep in mind is this: The likelihood of an adverse vaccine reaction is very, very small. The likelihood of an unvaccinated pup contracting distemper or parvo and becoming very ill is very, very high.

Most adverse reactions are fairly mild and easily treatable (hives, facial swelling, etc.), if treated promptly. If it's these you're worried about, give a dose of diphenhydramine beforehand, and give the full dose of vaccine to ensure you're meeting the minimum to provide an immune response (otherwise, what's the point?). Still concerned? Have an IV cath placed and leave the pet at the clinic for monitoring.

Even if you have to do all the above, surely it's worth it to prevent distemper?

And as far as anaphylaxis goes, if a particular antigen is going to cause that severe of a reaction for that particular patient, I can't imagine there's ANY safe dose...even a half-dose.

And your comment couldn't be further from the truth. Reactions happen every day, every time a dog, human, cat or animal gets vaccinated. The shot you mention basically blocks the body from reacting outwardly. By no means does that mean there isnt a reaction going on.

You should also know, distemper and parvo are both treatable. Natural rearing breeders and owners do so everyday.
My 14 year old dogs never once from age 6 and on recieved vaccines, heartworm, flea and tick chemicals and guess what? They never once had a problem. Not once. They were fed a raw diet and supplements to support their immune system vs destroy it with a chemical created to just mask symptoms of a reaction. My current dogs are the same. My only issue now is they are all fixed and don't have the hormones their bodies are meant to have to function beyond their "childhood" months resulting in a very immature, even if trained adult age dog. Those hormones allow us to mature, a dog fixed at 6 months, never even gets the chance, remaining the 9 year old "child" for life.
Back to vaccines, the chance of reaction is not known because follow ups are never done and studies of reactions dont take into account the environment of the dog. Test dogs are sterile, dogs in our lives are far from sterile. Vaccine reactions can include a vast array of issues and there is no way to determine what came from the dogs history and what came from the vaccine without years of following the experts blindly and even then, it will be impossible for years to prove what came from a vaccine.

Please tell me how, exactly, distemper is "highly treatable". The veterinary community would love to know, especially if it's easier and better for the pet than those 2-3 pesky immunizations, spaced 2-4 weeks apart...

And parvo, for that matter. Parvo treatment keeps improving, but I've yet to see something work better than not getting it.

No one said highly treatable but you. I said natural rearing breeders and owners treat it, if you would like to know, dig. Just like I did. Those pesky shots are by no means entering any of my dogs, puppies ever. And the vet community would actually love to shut me and others like me up.

I have been a tech for almost 10 years. I have seen a few vaccine reactions (like 2-5 per year in a busy practice). I've never seen a pet die, or have long-lasting illness from a vaccine reaction. I have seen puppies die of parvo despite treatment. And the parvo puppies that survive have medical bills in the $1000-$5000 range.

Also, your comment about diphenhydramine "blocking the body from acting outwardly" speaks volumes about your understanding of biochemistry and physiology. Antihistamines block histamine release, histamines are INSIDE the body. Blocking their release prevents outward signs like hives, facial swelling and anaphylaxis.

You haven't seen a long term vaccine reaction? Have you never come across a case of VAS?? cause if not, let me introduce you to my Ollie - oh wait I can't, he died of VAS. Ok then, let me introduce you to my Fleurp who became severely anemic after her last set of vaccines. Took months to "fix" her and my vet out and out said (with out my asking) that he will never vaccinate her again.

Vaccine reactions happen. Just because you haven't seen them doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

So in a metaphorical sense you are telling me that if I am screwing two pieces of wood together and the screw can't get through, yet I keep screwing, that the pressure, instead of splitting the wood, will just poof and disappear? No, that can't happen. That energy has to go somewhere and even if you don't see it, it is there and being expressed in another way. I didn't even bring up the fact that the shot to get the vaccine suppresses the immune system, which by following manufacturer label for any vaccine, that animal is not supposed to receive the vaccine as he or she is not healthy if they require a shot to not react. Oh wait, I forgot, no one ever felt is was a good idea to define healthy... till dogs and cats started reacting. Enough so that the entire state of california, florida, and a few others have put in place exemptions for these dogs, cats, and other pets.
You somehow missed my point. I stated we have no way of proving/knowing what is a vaccine reaction and what is just the dog so therefore you could've seen a reaction and not known it was a reaction and vice versa. You can't prove it is a vaccine reaction when it is one and you cant prove it isnt a vaccine reaction when it isnt one. That is exactly how big pharma wants it too. All the freedom to put mercury, formaldehyde, etc in ones body with no liability for the after effects till it is too late. Not only that, but you do realize how dogs got parvo to begin with right? It was in the cat tissue used to cultivate vaccines for dogs. So in effect, we shot ourselves in the foot in the effort to beat nature at its own game.

As far as I am concerned, nature has it's way. You, nor I, nor science will beat nature.

By this logic, why seek veterinary or medical care at all? Nature has its way, if it's gonna die it's gonna die. If it's not strong enough to survive, might as well let the pet die.

Doesn't make sense to me. Enjoy your parvovirus, smallpox, polio, and rabies, though.

All I am saying is vaccines including rabies should hands down be a choice. No one said you couldn't do them, but they are a.) not 100% effective and b) carry known risk requiring a wavier be signed to prevent all parties involved in production and administering such vaccine from being sued. I choose not to vaccinate and I am well aware of the risk. I keep what I need to help my dogs and other animals should they come down with something generally known as an emergency kit. And no I am not against rushing my pets to an emergency allopathic vet should they need it to live, but at that point, I have a decision to make resulting in an actual being dying. Why do we go around acting as if an emergency exist every day, when by common sense, that waste energy and resources for a real emergency.

I don't understand how I not vaccinating would effect you in any way. If you are immune, what threat can there be? And just for pointing it outs sake...If rabies is so dangerous, why are we humans not required to get vaccinated as well before exposure? If our domestic in-house dogs are(but not livestock), why would we not be required for such vaccination as well?

No vet, that is obviously an "expert"( quoted for those that are absolutely far from expert in their field of work as there are many refusing to move on from outdated information), in their field should have to risk their license in order to do the right thing by the patient.

I'd take you over my former vet any day. Though in my case I'm more worried that the dose is large enough for my mastiff rather than the other way around.

When my former vet tried to insist on a multi-vaccine shot for my 10week old pup, who'd just had his last shot barely two weeks before.....and then went through the roof when I refused....I changed vets. I understand about the rabies vaccine, the law requires what the law requires and we all get to struggle with that.

The question should be do we even need to vaccinate at all. No one knows the long term effects as the longest study done to date is three years and manufacturers, unless forced by public opinion will not perform longer studies to a) reduce or b) eliminate the need for their products. No follow up is done to figure out what damage is done over the years from foreign substances injected into ourselves and our dogs. Fact of the matter is, vaccines keep us and our dogs immune systems sick and weakened and will result in higher profits for the pharma industry, even if required by law to look legit. When scrutinized, even mandatory rabies vaccines dont stand up to the facts that rabies is a) a self limiting disease given it is fatal and therefore epidemics would be impossible, b) the fact that rabies was suddenly mandated after 14 years of no cases in Pinellas county, Florida, and C) the fact that rates of disease follow proportionately the highest vaccinated areas.
Studies are also starting to show that vaccines can and do affect DNA in a way resulting in various auto-immune diseases, including my dog. Years from now when vaccines are officially done away with, we will see them in the same light as we now see blood letting as a cure to disease. Nothing defeats nature. Rabies will be here when we are gone unless all the animals that can carry the disease are gone. Nature has a way of providing those meant to live with the system needed as harsh as that sounds. I see this everyday on my farm. The pharma industry seems to be trying to override that knowledge and could therefore eventually have control over who lives and who dies. Do we really want that?
Don't believe me? At least look it up for yourselves. Worst case scenario is you a) know the disagreements points and can respond vs react, b) you will know where to turn if you decide you eventually agree.

The answer to your initial question is YES. We do need to vaccinate.
Your posts are contradictory. You state that Parvo and Distemper are treatable. Then you talk about epidemics and natural selection.
You are right. Rabies will exist in certain areas as long as there is a wildlife reserve. That is why we should vaccinate our pets. Do you want to euthanize or watch your pet die of rabies?? Do you want to watch your loved one die of Rabies??
"No one knows the long term effects(of vaccines)..."
Well the long term effect of Rabies is death. We know that.

Yes, epidemics do happen. Just as smallpox did, but there were people that survived including the 7 billion plus today. Some because they were exposed to a milder form of the disease and had crossover immunity. Same with polio, people survived and not just because the vaccines came out seeing as records show the diseases were already declining before any vaccines were invented.
Dogs and other pets survive parvo and distemper without getting the shot. They do so because they have owners that care enough to know how to and have in turn, prepared for the worst, but hope for the best. You also failed to mentioned that all puppies that go to a vet clinic are exposed to both distemper and parvo before receiving any shots. Why vaccinate if the pup is already been exposed and is therefore immune?
My answer for vaccination is no and by all means I should have the option of fully declining something I have to sign a liability wavier for. If it was not a risk, the wavier for me not to sue the manufacturer, veterinarian, and anyone else involved in my pet receiving such vaccine would be pointless.

Not to get to into such discussion, but would I be such a risk if you vaccinate and receive immunity? I would be of no threat to you or your pets if you choose to vaccinate and it happens to be 100% effective. Right?

And to point out, there are risk both ways. Knowing both sides of the story hurts no one but the willingly blind.

And as a theory to just throw out there... We have antibiotics that kill all living things and over use of such has lead to a current problem...superbugs. Could over vaccination eventually lead to vaccines no longer working if the virus' meant to be eliminated mutate just as every living bacteria/virus does to survive? Again, antibacterial soap being a second example of such happening in our overly clean world.

And again, you do realize we in the past ten to twenty years have vaccinated wildlife with a modified live rabies virus vaccine resulting in rabies actually being contracted and spread further? What's with all the contradictions if our(government) goal is to eliminate the virus? Oh..wait...big pharma would no longer be able to sell the number one selling money maker for their business in the pet industry...a rabies vaccine.

Last time, I promise...I am not against allopathic medicine, but I highly believe it has way overstepped it's boundaries on what it can do long term. Super-bugs are already proving that point for me. Our highest in the world healthcare cost already prove that to me. Our pets are following proportionately as we do the same things we do to them as we have transferred to.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure that Rabies epidemics can and do happen. Rabies is not self-limiting. Transmission happens during contact with an affected animal BEFORE the animal dies. One infected animal can have contact with many potential hosts before it dies.

Just had this discussion with one of my vets yesterday... I was telling him how one of the 4 lb maltese he was drawing titers on had a bad reaction to a parvo vaccine 2 years ago. Within a few hours after the vaccine was given little Mia had severe vomiting & diarrhea and had to be given antiemetics and fluids. The previous vet said she didn't know that the vaccine caused the vomiting/diarrhea (in the previously perfectly healthy dog). But then she said that it's what she calls "little white dog syndrome." Obviously she's had something similar happen before since she has a name for it! The vet yesterday said "I don't care if that vet is a friend of mine - and I don't want to know who it was - but you should not go back to that vet!" He said there should have been a report sent regarding the reaction. I am aware that strictly scientifically speaking, there would have to be extensive testing to PROVE cause & effect and even then it wouldn't PROVE my $400 vet bill was due to the vaccine. But it is frustrating to have the vet shrug her shoulders and laugh it off.

Your new vet is right. Vaccine reactions should be reported. Often the vaccine manufacturer will pay for all or part of any treatment required.
"little white dog syndrome" does exist. But so does "Weimaraner" syndrome and "anything merle or blue" syndrome. Some breeds and some individual dogs have "interesting" genetics and resulting "interesting and unpredictable" immune systems.
Those dogs should be treated with kid-gloves when administering future vaccinations.

I have to say is that I wish there were more Vet's like you! You are very knowledeable and timely with your articles, but most of all, you truley care about your animal clients AND their owners! If you ever feel the urge to move to Ocala and start a practice here, I will make sure that your practice is successful! THANKS for ALL that YOU DO!!!

Yes, I like that she is not afraid to bring up so many different subjects for discussion. And that she doesn't mind explaining her rationale. It is refreshing to know that someone is willing to think things through and ask questions instead of just falling back on the "this is how we've always done it" rhetoric!

You only talk dogs here, but I can't help but think of cats. You say they test vaccines on "average" dogs, which I'm assuming are over 20lbs.. and a 1 cc vaccine is safe and effective for that. And the incidents of occurrence of adverse reactions increases in smaller pets.. well cats fall into that 'smaller' size category. Cats are routinely vaccinated when they are just a few pounds, and since the average cat is about ten pounds (with some notable exceptions) I can't help but wonder if that is why VAS is rarely found in dogs..

Great post for thought. thank you for sharing.

I took my 6 month old chi/terrier in for his shots. he got 2 injections. I know one was the DHLPP. About 15 minutes after we got home, my dog kept pawing at his face, a few moments later his face was swelling. I called the vet that gave him the shot, they said bring him back to the clinic asap. As I drove he was getting worse and was not able to breathe and went from panicky yelping to almost limp. I exited the freeway and rushed to the nearest vet because i knew he was dying. They said he had a severe anaphylactic reaction and noted his chart with "no lepto ever"....that was almost 2 years ago. I have not been able to have him vaccinated since. im just too scared. My new vet wants to vaccinate him in 2 seperate visits about 2 weeks apart and hospitalize him all day for both visits so he can be closely monitored in case something goes wrong. Well ive seen just how "wrong" things can go and im just not sure the payoff is worth the risk. this has scarred me for life.

I can't believe that any vet would want to vaccinate your poor doggie after that near death experience! You can get titers drawn for parvo, distemper and even rabies. One question too - did your vet inform you of the risk associated with vaccinations? What if you'd lived a couple of minutes away and dropped the dog off at home and gone grocery shopping?! He would have died a horrible death. My new vet just told me that it is perfectly legal to opt out of vaccines if the dog has had a reaction. He vaccinates (core vaccines - with a month between individual vaccines) his dogs as puppies, gives 1 yr boosters and then titers them after that. We would never knowingly give any person something that caused anaphylactic shock! And a dog shouldn't be given any such substance either. I'm just horrified at your vet wanting to vaccinate again

It is good to finally have someone tell me its ok to not want to vaccinate again. Ive had 3 different vets try to convince me to vaccinate again. They told me that a reaction as severe as his is very uncommon, and that a 2nd reaction is almost unheard of. Well im pretty sure the reason that a 2nd reaction is so unheard of is because most people dont give their dog a 2nd shot after the 1st one almost killed him. His shots were given at a spay/neuter clinic and they did not discuss anything about reactions. She did at one point hand me a pamplet right after she put lucas up on the table to prepare him for his vaccination, I asked her what it was and she said "oh its just a pamplet explaining the benifits and the possible side effects of the vaccine, we hand them out as standard procedure, nothing to worry about." So i didnt even bother to look at it after her reassurance. In fact i didnt read it until i realized there was something very wrong with my dog. And i never thought about it but you are so right, if i wouldve just dropped him off at home and left..he wouldve died a horrible death. Nobody has ever mentioned "titers" before and I dont understand so can you please tell me more about it? I actually did ask my vet if they could just give him a little of the vaccine, but they said no. They want to give it all or nothing. They say if i love him, i should protect him from the things most likely to kill him. To me..thats what im doing. anyway, id like to know more about titers. thank you so much for your time and help.

Nolene,
Just passing on what my vet told me this past week when I took my 2 little maltese in to have titers drawn. I did pet therapy with a friend whose German Shepherd (import from Germany) almost died after vaccines. According to her the dogs in Europe are not vaccinated every year like dogs here in the US. She did titers and used a vet in town who takes care of the police dogs & horses. So that's who I started taking my guys to for titers. He is a DVM.

The first thing you may be told about titers is that they are not 100% accurate. But vaccines are not 100% effective either if you want to press the issue. In fact it is very important that the titers are done by a good lab. All labs are not equal according to this vet. Because of this, it is expensive to do titers including rabies. It costs me about $100 plus $30 shipping to use his recommended lab. (Shipping is for up to 5 samples so I do all my dogs at once).

Now, I'm a critical care ICU nurse so I love traditional medicine. I am uncomfortable with the "all holistic all the time" approach you come across regarding vaccinations when you start researching vaccines and titers. That said, I am relieved to find that there are finally animal studies showing that core vaccines last 8 years to life.

My older vet friend (who taught Orthopedic surgery at University of Georgia and Auburn University) told me 25 years ago that they knew rabies vaccines lasted at least 8 years. But as Dr. Khuly stated, she could lose her license if she didn't do rabies as prescribed by law. Here in Florida, the 3 year rabies vacc is legal, but it must be labeled for 3 years. And many vets never tell you about it, nor do they carry it. By law the animal can have a vet's letter exempting them from even rabies if they are too old, ill or have had a reaction such as your dog's. If you obtain copy of your local animal laws you should be able to find it. That said, if the dog had a potential rabies exposure, you would have to treat him as unvaccinated.

The bottom line is that rabies is a public health issue. (PERIOD)! That is why rabies is different from any other vaccine. But the law does address exceptions from the rabies vaccine.

One of my favorite websites with a wealth of information on a number of subjects is the canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels site. Under the table of contents there is a whole section of titer & vaccination information.

Your dog's reaction was to a vaccine that is not required by law so it isn't even an issue in my opinion! I would go shopping for a vet who doesn't put vaccines before the health of the individual animal. A good DVM who also practices holistic medicine might send you in the right direction. Or you might be plesantly surprised by a younger vet as I find they are now taught that animal studies show the humoral immunity provided by vaccines lasts many years. Good luck in advocating for your little one! It is frustrating and irritating and expensive but well worth it! I mean, how many people do you know who are vaccinated every year for every disease known to man? Human doctors would never get away with doing that! : )

Dr. K.
“…38.2 adverse vaccine reactions were observed for every 10,000 dogs.”

.....Depends on how they’re defining an adverse reaction.

“the injection of multiple vaccines at one time is likelier to yield adverse vaccine events.”

Yeah and just try to find single vax!

.....As far as more study, they’ll always used the biggest dose possible, as every immune system is different. The only way to tell if the dog has responded to the vaccine is to do a titer first, vaccinate, then do another titer. Still doesn’t mean the dog is necessarily protected. But I'd take that over shooting the dog up with multi-antigen vax yearly.

.....The only vaccine required by law is rabies. Multi-antigen vaccines are bad news AFAIC. Where in nature would a critter encounter 4-5 diseases all at the same time? Common sense would tell you this is overwhelming to the immune system. Vaccines are a medical procedure. Discussion, warnings of side effects, should all take place before giving them. At no time should they be given w/o the owner's permission.

.........I'm sure most people don't even think about it as being an issue of discussion. And giving single vax means more vet bills, something people avoid in the best of times and can't afford in the worst.

Thank you for the very interesting info..I had no idea rabies shots lasted that long. Nor did i know that certain medical conditions can allow your pet to be exempt from vaccinations. I find this very upsetting because i was never told of it and (1) my dog has a heart condition (that i believe was caused by the reaction to the vaccine) and (2) my dog was just discoved less than a month ago to have a condition that they cannot diagnose because it has never been seen before. And they cant tell me if its serious or not because they cant diagnose it. I even got a second opinion and they agreed with the first opinion and tell me that it is going to take some extensive testing to be able to make a diagnosis. All they can tell me is that its not normal. Yet they still pushed for the vaccinations and heartworm prevention. I did do the heartworm prevention. Its a little confusing as to why they would try to encourage vaccinating with his history of past reaction, heart problem and undiagnosed condition, as it seems this would be a gauranteed death sentence. I am going to go to the site you mentioned and do some reading. Dont all doctors take an oath to "first do no harm" or someting like that? Im worried they may not have lucas best interest at heart. But since like you say, law doesnt require these vaccines, i will stand by my decision to opt out. Anyway, on an end note id like to say that i have alot of respect for the job you do. Being an icu nurse and caring for the most fragile of lives is a very admirible thing.

Nolene,
Don't know where you live, but I'm in Florida and wouldn't dream of NOT giving heartworm preventative. I use Interceptor because it is more weight appropriate. Just way too many dogs around here with heartworms. Know there are people who don't believe in putting poison into their animals, but having done rescue for years and working with many animals with heartworms, I believe the risk of not giving HW preventative is greater. Of course, if the dog is unable to tolerate the preventative, that should be addressed individually by the vet. I remember one vet telling me how it broke his heart for poor people to come in and ask for vaccines which he knew the dog didn't need but said they couldn't afford the HW preventative. He said he would try to talk them into the HW meds and not get the vaccines. But that previous vets had made them feel they didn't love their animal if they didn't get vaccines. So sad.

You know, Never before have i given a second thought about vaccinating any dog ive ever owned, until this happened to me. I had no idea that a vaccine shot could be so deadly. The vets make it sound like theres almost a zero percent chance of anything going wrong. And the thing that makes me mad is that no matter how rare it is for a dog to die from it. Dogs have died from it. But the small percentage that have died are apparently not important enough for a vet to say "Hey this shot has been known to kill some dogs so you might want to give it some thought before deciding to vaccinate him." I gaurantee that if any of those vets ever watched their own pet suffer and nearly die in agony...they might not be so quick to sugarcoat the awful truth.

The fact is, there are many cases of adverse vaccine reactions that are NOT REPORTED by veterinarians to the vaccine manufacturers. (Shame on you vets!)
So when the vet tells you the percentage is very small for adverse reactions, this simply is not true.
People, please educate yourselves by visiting:
www.rabieschallengefund.org to learn the truth about vaccines.
Many times when an animal has had an adverse reaction when vaccinated (as it can take up to 75 days to be noticed), the vet will say it was "idiopathic".
Veterinarians are NOT immunologists.....they simply don't have all the facts and sell you what they were taught.... never mind that it may hurt your loved ones in the process...
Dr. Ronald Schultz has studied immunology for years...do a google search for him and you will get quite an education on vaccines and the immune system.

The rabieschallengefund.com website is great! Thanks for the info. I had forgotten about it although I have high regard for Dr. Jean Dodds and her work trying to protect animals from excessive vaccinations. I was looking for the info on the challenge studies on core/noncore vaccines out of Texas but can't locate it right now. Hard to make sure info on line is accurate. Even Dr. Dodds has been misquoted on her vaccine protocols. So frustrating!